Bio-fuels unintended consequences?

[John Gault]

http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/07_06/b4020093.htm?chan=top+news_top+news+index_top+stor y

This massive production of bio fuels has helped reduce the cost of gas a whopping 1 or 2cents.

It has caused an increase in the cost of food to the point that some countries are experiencing food riots.

A 50% reduction in the use of corn for biofuel here in the US would reduce the cost of a bushel of corn by nearly 1/2. That would alleviate much of the preassure on food prices and effect the price of gas not at all.

Some call these unintended consequences but many analyts predicted this in the beggining of these programs.

This is not a partisan issue qas both parties support this.

But I believe it is a political issue. With Iowa being a top producer of corn and also being one of the first in the primary process they have unusual sway on agrucultural issues.

[Trueblue]

I understand that other biologicals may be better, such as sugar cane.

Of course, the point of biofuels is not prices, but energy independence and improvement of the environment.

[John Gault]

I understand that other biologicals may be better, such as sugar cane.

Of course, the point of biofuels is not prices, but energy independence and improvement of the environment.

So that is ok when you might cause the prices of food to go so hight the poor can't afford them?

I guess if there were fewer people that would improve the environment and in some 3rd world countries that might end up being an unintended consequence.

PS - In the midwest (Iowa) you can't grow sugar cane. Besides you think the corn lobby and Senator Grassly will allow that ?

[issac the dragon]

Quote[In the midwest (Iowa) you can't grow sugar cane. Besides you think the corn lobby and Senator Grassly will allow that ?] end quote

That is unconscionable. I think the only thing in the US with a lower rating than Bush is Congress. Sometimes I think we'd be better off if we sent them home permanently. But that would leave Bush in charge.
__________________

[Trueblue]

So that is ok when you might cause the prices of food to go so hight the poor can't afford them?

I guess if there were fewer people that would improve the environment and in some 3rd world countries that might end up being an unintended consequence.

PS - In the midwest (Iowa) you can't grow sugar cane. Besides you think the corn lobby and Senator Grassly will allow that ?

So you think that this entire problem is simple and easy to solve? :lmao

[John Gault]

So you think that this entire problem is simple and easy to solve? :lmao

Do you believe we should not try to?

But to answer your question...

Yes, remove the government mandate to use bio based fuels at certain levels.

Did you bother to read the article?

[Trueblue]

Do you believe we should not try to?

But to answer your question...

Yes, remove the government mandate to use bio based fuels at certain levels.

Did you bother to read the article?

Believe we should not try to what?

[matrixx8]

http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/07_06/b4020093.htm?chan=top+news_top+news+index_top+stor y

This massive production of bio fuels has helped reduce the cost of gas a whopping 1 or 2cents.

It has caused an increase in the cost of food to the point that some countries are experiencing food riots.

A 50% reduction in the use of corn for biofuel here in the US would reduce the cost of a bushel of corn by nearly 1/2. That would alleviate much of the preassure on food prices and effect the price of gas not at all.

Some call these unintended consequences but many analyts predicted this in the beggining of these programs.

This is not a partisan issue qas both parties support this.

But I believe it is a political issue. With Iowa being a top producer of corn and also being one of the first in the primary process they have unusual sway on agrucultural issues.
This is an important issue, John. I agree. The benefits of such a short-term measure do not seem to outway the disadvantages.

Sooner or later, everyone one on earth will have to face the fact that certain energy sources are finite. Renewable energy is clearly one part of the equation for the future.

Another factor, more difficult to contemplate for many, may be the need drastically to reduce one's eco-footprint.

[matrixx8]

Good post.

[Wabash]

So you think that this entire problem is simple and easy to solve? :lmao
Hell no, but the Demos have mucked it up so bad and hamstring the oil producers, we have been forced to go to this ridiculous ethanol crap! 3 of my motorcycles are already running oddly from it...and I never like it when govt. stuffs something down my throat that I vehemently oppose! Fuck corn fuel!

This is an important issue, John. I agree. The benefits of such a short-term measure do not seem to outway the disadvantages.
RightO!!!

Sooner or later, everyone one on earth will have to face the fact that certain energy sources are finite.Not in our lifetime or our kids! Renewable energy is clearly one part of the equation for the future.
Tell it to the Enviro whackos who keep screwing up the logging industry with their silly assed ideas! Trees are our only really renewable resource and logging has been seriously curtailed because of liberal ass wipes!!

Another factor, more difficult to contemplate for many, may be the need drastically to reduce one's eco-footprint.
Damn right it is!!! And I'm not doing it!

[Trueblue]

Wabash, we can't limit our concern to just the next generation.

The sun and wind are far better potential resources than trees, anyway. As are quicker growing crops. It takes decades to grow a forest, and we are losing them at an alarming rate.

[issac the dragon]

There are so many things that we need to do, and we are so far very reluctant to do any of them except bitch.

We need to stop living miles away from where we work and shop. Forget a home in the forest, or the suburbs. That home in the suburbs is probably built on prime farm land any way. As much as we don't want to hear it, we are going to have to build up, not out.

We need to put trillions into our transportation system. And it is going to take tax money. It does no good to have public transportation, if it doesn't get you near where you are going. People will not use the bus if they have to walk two miles to stand in the rain and wait for it. And park and rides are full by 6:30AM weekdays.

We need to invest trillions into wind and solar power. People need to stop with the NIMBY attitude.

We need to stop doing things which damage the earth because they provide jobs. Cutting down forests to keep people working is self-defeating. So is coal mining. And doing it in someone else's country is not ok.

Above all, we need to stop breeding. The earth is full. Over full. If we have to pass laws, then we need to do that. These are just a few of the things we have to do, and no one in the government is going to do one of them.

[matrixx8]

Hell no, but the Demos have mucked it up so bad and hamstring the oil producers, we have been forced to go to this ridiculous ethanol crap! 3 of my motorcycles are already running oddly from it...and I never like it when govt. stuffs something down my throat that I vehemently oppose! Fuck corn fuel!

Just because he started an unlawful war in Iraq is no reason to question Bush's motives on bio-fuels, Wabash.

For example (http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSN2938716420080529?pageNumber=2&virtualBrandChannel=10112):

The biofuels industry has thrived under George W. Bush as president. The former Texas oil man has worked to increase biofuel production as part of his grander plan to trim the country's dependence on foreign oil imports.
The next problem you may face is the upcoming choice of presidential candidates.

Republican presidential candidate John McCain and his likely Democrat rival, Barack Obama, will remain steadfast in their support for biofuels on the road to the White House, despite rising global discontent over the idea of using crops to make fuel.
It's a complex issue, I agree. In any case, I sympathize with anyone who has to run three motorcycles on bio-fuels.

How many legs do you have, by the way?

[matrixx8]

There are so many things that we need to do, and we are so far very reluctant to do any of them except bitch.

We need to stop living miles away from where we work and shop. Forget a home in the forest, or the suburbs. That home in the suburbs is probably built on prime farm land any way. As much as we don't want to hear it, we are going to have to build up, not out.

We need to put trillions into our transportation system. And it is going to take tax money. It does no good to have public transportation, if it doesn't get you near where you are going. People will not use the bus if they have to walk two miles to stand in the rain and wait for it. And park and rides are full by 6:30AM weekdays.

We need to invest trillions into wind and solar power. People need to stop with the NIMBY attitude.

We need to stop doing things which damage the earth because they provide jobs. Cutting down forests to keep people working is self-defeating. So is coal mining. And doing it in someone else's country is not ok.

Above all, we need to stop breeding. The earth is full. Over full. If we have to pass laws, then we need to do that. These are just a few of the things we have to do, and no one in the government is going to do one of them.
Just about covers everything. Really good post.

[jim]

There are so many things that we need to do, and we are so far very reluctant to do any of them except bitch.

We need to stop living miles away from where we work and shop. Forget a home in the forest, or the suburbs. That home in the suburbs is probably built on prime farm land any way. As much as we don't want to hear it, we are going to have to build up, not out.

We need to put trillions into our transportation system. And it is going to take tax money. It does no good to have public transportation, if it doesn't get you near where you are going. People will not use the bus if they have to walk two miles to stand in the rain and wait for it. And park and rides are full by 6:30AM weekdays.

We need to invest trillions into wind and solar power. People need to stop with the NIMBY attitude.

We need to stop doing things which damage the earth because they provide jobs. Cutting down forests to keep people working is self-defeating. So is coal mining. And doing it in someone else's country is not ok.

Above all, we need to stop breeding. The earth is full. Over full. If we have to pass laws, then we need to do that. These are just a few of the things we have to do, and no one in the government is going to do one of them.


Great Post!!:yep

[jim]

Just about covers everything. Really good post.


It Does!!And it is:yep