Do any of you on the left agree with this ruling?

[Capitalist]

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/03/07/MNJDVF0F1.DTL

Parents can be criminally prosecuted for failing to comply, Croskey said.

"A primary purpose of the educational system is to train school children in good citizenship, patriotism and loyalty to the state and the nation as a means of protecting the public welfare," the judge wrote, quoting from a 1961 case on a similar issue.

Now this is scary...

But of course the unions love it:

Union pleased with ruling
The ruling was applauded by a director for the state's largest teachers union.

"We're happy," said Lloyd Porter, who is on the California Teachers Association board of directors. "We always think students should be taught by credentialed teachers, no matter what the setting."

Gee i wonder why? I doubt their concerns over the kids not being taught by teachers goes past the swell in dues paying members this could cause.


For all of you so concerned with privacy, this is also scary:

Heimov said her organization's chief concern was not the quality of the children's education, but their "being in a place daily where they would be observed by people who had a duty to ensure their ongoing safety."

For those that say the government should not intrude on our private lives, that must bother you at least a little bit?

[patriotsblade]

I couldn't agree with you more on the first part of this. It's not a school's duty to train school children in good citizenship, patriotism and loyalty to the state and the nation as a means of protecting the public welfare That sounds downright Orwellian.

Parents have a responsibility to ensure that their child receives an education equivalent or superior to one they would receive in public school if they choose to home school them though. Society has to deal with these kids in eventually. I think there has to be some verifiable standard for home schooling. These parents need to demonstrate that they are capable of providing an adequate education and the students need to demonstrate they are receiving one.

BTW Capitalist, it's the right hand side of the political spectrum that likes to scream the loudest about government intrusion in people's private lives. Not the left.

[Capitalist]

I couldn't agree with you more on the first part of this. It's not a school's duty to That sounds downright Orwellian.

Parents have a responsibility to ensure that their child receives an education equivalent or superior to one they would receive in public school if they choose to home school them though. Society has to deal with these kids in eventually. I think there has to be some verifiable standard for home schooling. These parents need to demonstrate that they are capable of providing an adequate education and the students need to demonstrate they are receiving one.

BTW Capitalist, it's the right hand side of the political spectrum that likes to scream the loudest about government intrusion in people's private lives. Not the left.

What you said makes no sense?

[issac the dragon]

I don't think this is a simple issue at all. The state has the right to demand that parents educate their children for the good of society. The how they get educated is the problem.

Some people are into home schooling because they want to be sure that their children are never exposed to any point of view but their own. That is pretty much brain washing. I don't think that is right. Sorry, I don't think parents own their children.

There is a lot that is bad in some public schools and some home schools. And a lot of good in both. I would suggest that the parents in California take the case to the legislators and try to change the laws. And while they are at it, have a debate on what exactly the state can demand in the teaching of children. And not every one who is a parent is fit to teach.

[Capitalist]

I don't think this is a simple issue at all. The state has the right to demand that parents educate their children for the good of society. The how they get educated is the problem.

Some people are into home schooling because they want to be sure that their children are never exposed to any point of view but their own. That is pretty much brain washing. I don't think that is right. Sorry, I don't think parents own their children.

There is a lot that is bad in some public schools and some home schools. And a lot of good in both. I would suggest that the parents in California take the case to the legislators and try to change the laws. And while they are at it, have a debate on what exactly the state can demand in the teaching of children. And not every one who is a parent is fit to teach.

"A primary purpose of the educational system is to train school children in good citizenship, patriotism and loyalty to the state and the nation as a means of protecting the public welfare,"

You don't think that is brainwashing?

The problem here is that this ruling means NO parent can homeschool their child unless they are a teacher.

I can tell you that if I choose to home school my son that my wife could do as good a job as any teacher, hell she does it now as do I with his readin his math.

I think that this could be taken to the US supreme court and won by home schoolers.

[April15]

This law has been on the books since 1953. I believe it was done to counter any communist education.

[Indy]

I do not agree that the primary purpose of the educational system is to "train school children in good citizenship, patriotism and loyalty to the state and the nation as a means of protecting the public welfare."

The primary purpose of school is reading, writing, and arithmatic. Everything else (AND I DO MEAN EVERYTHING) is secondary in my view.

[Capitalist]

This law has been on the books since 1953. I believe it was done to counter any communist education.

It was wrong then and it is wrong now.

What is interesting is that many people home school for that reason.

[Cookie Parker]

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/03/07/MNJDVF0F1.DTL



Now this is scary...

But of course the unions love it:



Gee i wonder why? I doubt their concerns over the kids not being taught by teachers goes past the swell in dues paying members this could cause.


For all of you so concerned with privacy, this is also scary:



For those that say the government should not intrude on our private lives, that must bother you at least a little bit?

Actually, it's the law in California...I have no sympathy for those who break the law and then cry "religious discrimination". They hate this country, then move to Iraq.

A California appeals court ruling clamping down on homeschooling by parents without teaching credentials sent shock waves across the state this week, leaving an estimated 166,000 children as possible truants and their parents at risk of prosecution.

The homeschooling movement never saw the case coming.

"At first, there was a sense of, 'No way,' " said homeschool parent Loren Mavromati, a resident of Redondo Beach (Los Angeles County) who is active with a homeschool association. "Then there was a little bit of fear. I think it has moved now into indignation."

The ruling arose from a child welfare dispute between the Los Angeles County Department of Children and Family Services and Philip and Mary Long of Lynwood, who have been homeschooling their eight children. Mary Long is their teacher, but holds no teaching credential.

The parents said they also enrolled their children in Sunland Christian School, a private religious academy in Sylmar (Los Angeles County), which considers the Long children part of its independent study program and visits the home about four times a year.

The Second District Court of Appeal ruled that California law requires parents to send their children to full-time public or private schools or have them taught by credentialed tutors at home.

Some homeschoolers are affiliated with private or charter schools, like the Longs, but others fly under the radar completely. Many homeschooling families avoid truancy laws by registering with the state as a private school and then enroll only their own children.

[Capitalist]

Actually, it's the law in California...I have no sympathy for those who break the law and then cry "religious discrimination". They hate this country, then move to Iraq.

Moron, it is not just religious people that home school.

Try getting your head out of your ass.

Oh, BTW - Do you have the same problem with illegal aliens breaking the law?

Rather selective today aren't we.

[Cookie Parker]

Moron, it is not just religious people that home school.

Try getting your head out of your ass.

Oh, BTW - Do you have the same problem with illegal aliens breaking the law?

Rather selective today aren't we.

Idiot....it is an extremely undereducated man who can read an article where it states they went to a religious school and come away with your comment.

In addition, Iraq is the newest wave of democracy from Bush. People don't like it they have to have qualified teachers to teach their children, take them to Iraq.

Now, what part of violating the law did you not get from this article and what can I teach you......I'm all for trying to make republicans smart...as hopeless a cause as that apparently is.

[Capitalist]

Idiot....it is an extremely undereducated man who can read an article where it states they went to a religious school and come away with your comment.

In addition, Iraq is the newest wave of democracy from Bush. People don't like it they have to have qualified teachers to teach their children, take them to Iraq.

Now, what part of violating the law did you not get from this article and what can I teach you......I'm all for trying to make republicans smart...as hopeless a cause as that apparently is.


And it takes a real tard to think that of the 166,000 home school criminals in Ca. are all because of religion.

Please at least try to keep up.

[Cookie Parker]

And it takes a real tard to think that of the 166,000 home school criminals in Ca. are all because of religion.

Please at least try to keep up.

No, it takes a retard to ASSUME that....I was speaking to the article of the people who were upset...THEY sent their kids to an accredited school...

See what happens when you think like LImbaugh...you, too , look like an ass.

[Capitalist]

No, it takes a retard to ASSUME that....I was speaking to the article of the people who were upset...THEY sent their kids to an accredited school...

See what happens when you think like LImbaugh...you, too , look like an ass.

Your too stupid to even try to have a conversation with.

To ignore for your dumb ass.

[Cookie Parker]

Your too stupid to even try to have a conversation with.

To ignore for your dumb ass.

ROFL!!!

Not surprising you give up....it gives most repubs a headache to have to look up all the big words I use..and find out they end of looking like an ass when they try to take me on....

[Trueblue]

I think this ruling is in error, and is too stringent. It intrudes on the rights of people.

I think that the purpose of school is to help children grow up to be productive citizens. That means that when they grow up, they can earn a living, manage their personal affairs, and participate in our democracy.

I think that it only makes sense to have some standards for homeschool instruction, but this carries it too far. Here in Tennessee, you must have a high school diploma to homeschool elementary children and a college degree to homeschool high school children. Unless you are afflilated with a church school, in which case anybody can teach elementary and someone with a HS diploma can teach high school grades.

[Capitalist]

I think this ruling is in error, and is too stringent. It intrudes on the rights of people.

I think that the purpose of school is to help children grow up to be productive citizens. That means that when they grow up, they can earn a living, manage their personal affairs, and participate in our democracy.

I think that it only makes sense to have some standards for homeschool instruction, but this carries it too far. Here in Tennessee, you must have a high school diploma to homeschool elementary children and a college degree to homeschool high school children. Unless you are afflilated with a church school, in which case anybody can teach elementary and someone with a HS diploma can teach high school grades.

MY GOD, we agree on something.

tell the cookie monster, I have her on ignore.

[Trueblue]

Oh, hell, no, do your own work. Lazy Publican! :lol

[Capitalist]

I think this ruling is in error, and is too stringent. It intrudes on the rights of people.

I think that the purpose of school is to help children grow up to be productive citizens. That means that when they grow up, they can earn a living, manage their personal affairs, and participate in our democracy.

I think that it only makes sense to have some standards for homeschool instruction, but this carries it too far. Here in Tennessee, you must have a high school diploma to homeschool elementary children and a college degree to homeschool high school children. Unless you are afflilated with a church school, in which case anybody can teach elementary and someone with a HS diploma can teach high school grades.


PS - we are a republic, not a democracy.

[Trueblue]

PS - we are a republic, not a democracy.

Wrong again! You fail to realize the changes that have taken place over the last two hundred years, we have a representative democracy. Publicans are always trapped in the past.

[Yellowdogtexan]

Your too stupid to even try to have a conversation with.

To ignore for your dumb ass.I moved this thread and if cappy is too dumb to know why, he needs to go re-read his posts on this thread.

[nixon]

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/03/07/MNJDVF0F1.DTL



Now this is scary...

But of course the unions love it:



Gee i wonder why? I doubt their concerns over the kids not being taught by teachers goes past the swell in dues paying members this could cause.


For all of you so concerned with privacy, this is also scary:



For those that say the government should not intrude on our private lives, that must bother you at least a little bit?It bothers me more than "a little bit", but what are we to do about it? Government and law enforcement are constantly crossing the line. What is your plan to address the issue(s)? How far are you willing to go to make things right?

[Cookie Parker]

It bothers me more than "a little bit", but what are we to do about it? Government and law enforcement are constantly crossing the line. What is your plan to address the issue(s)? How far are you willing to go to make things right?

What do you see not correct with the public education rulings? Do you think children should be taught by just ANYONE? Without a curriculum of advancing educations scales?

[Trueblue]

I'm willing to be somewhat lax in the requirements in the interest of giving people more freedom.

But if many people did this, we could end up with a very, very ignorant population.

[issac the dragon]

I think home schooling is fine if the kids are tested at regular intervals by the state to be sure they are learning. And I think they need to particapate in some school activities. Like sports. I don't think any child should be isolated.

[Lone Laugher]

If someone thinks they can provide a better education at home...or even just a "different" education for their own kids...then I say let them have at it. There is no need to regulate it at all.

[nixon]

What do you see not correct with the public education rulings? Do you think children should be taught by just ANYONE? Without a curriculum of advancing educations scales?Why do we need the government between a child and parent? Who would be more concern with a child's welfare, a parent or a government agency? For years, parents have schooled their children, what is different today than yesterday?

[April15]

I'm willing to be somewhat lax in the requirements in the interest of giving people more freedom.

But if many people did this, we could end up with a very, very ignorant population.NCLB is doing just that!

[Trueblue]

NCLB has to be changed because of unrealistic standards. Everyone can't be average or above. :twitch

However, the Response to Intervention strategy is holding schools accountable for ALL students, even if those students are poor, ESL, or in special education.