View Full Version : Prophecy
I was recently asked by another forum member why I thought we were in the EndTimes. I finally have collect most of my information and will post it here for him and all to see, debate, or debunk. I DO NOT say that I know for absolute certain that is where we are, but it is my belief that we are.
This is kind of long so bear with me.
First Prophecy
Daniel 7:1-8
1Earlier, during the first year of King Belshazzar's reign in Babylon, Daniel had a dream and saw visions as he lay in his bed. He wrote the dream down, and this is what he saw.
2In my vision that night, I, Daniel, saw a great storm churning the surface of a great sea, with strong winds blowing from every direction. 3Then four huge beasts came up out of the water, each different from the others.
4The first beast was like a lion with eagles' wings. As I watched, its wings were pulled off, and it was left standing with its two hind feet on the ground, like a human being. And a human mind was given to it.
5Then I saw a second beast, and it looked like a bear. It was rearing up on one side, and it had three ribs in its mouth between its teeth. And I heard a voice saying to it, "Get up! Devour many people!"
6Then the third of these strange beasts appeared, and it looked like a leopard. It had four wings like birds' wings on its back, and it had four heads. Great authority was given to this beast.
7Then in my vision that night, I saw a fourth beast, terrifying, dreadful, and very strong. It devoured and crushed its victims with huge iron teeth and trampled what was left beneath its feet. It was different from any of the other beasts, and it had ten horns. 8As I was looking at the horns, suddenly another small horn appeared among them. Three of the first horns were wrenched out, roots and all, to make room for it. This little horn had eyes like human eyes and a mouth that was boasting arrogantly.
A beast in Bible prophecy always represents a kingdom or nation. Multiple heads on a beast symbolize the number of times that nation will rise and fall.
The lion is the symbol of Britain and the eagle is the symbol of America. This passage I believe represents the revolutionary war.
The bear is the symbol of Russia
The Leopard represents Germany and the four head represent the Reich’s with the fourth on coming up our or in it currently
Second Prophecy
First Trumpet
7The first angel blew his trumpet, and hail and fire mixed with blood were thrown down upon the earth, and one-third of the earth was set on fire. One-third of the trees were burned, and all the grass was burned. Revelation 8:7
WW1, 8 million dead, was most likely the sounding of the first trumpet. The first trumpet speaks about all green grass and things being burnt up
It may not mean world wide but the German army had a burnt earth policy that they burnt every green thing in sight
Second Trumpet
8Then the second angel blew his trumpet, and a great mountain of fire was thrown into the sea. And one-third of the water in the sea became blood. 9And one-third of all things living in the sea died. And one-third of all the ships on the sea were destroyed. Revelation 8:8-9
WW2, 52 million dead, was most likely the sounding of the second trumpet. The second trumpet says that 1/3 of the ships would be destroyed. Just over 105,000 ships, naval and domestic, where in the ocean. 36,000 was sunk. Just over 1/3. It also says that a huge mountain of smoke and fire came out of the sea. That was Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
Third Trumpet
Then the third angel sounded; And a great star fell from heaven, burning like a torch, and it fell on a third of the rivers and on the springs of the water; and the name of the star is wormwood; and a third of the waters became wormwood; and many men died from the water, because it was made bitter. Revelation 8:10-11
Chernobyl means wormwood. The nuclear power plant in Russia was named for the pants that surround it. When it exploded it made all the water in the area undrinkable and lots of people died because of it.
Fourth Trumpet
12The fourth angel sounded his trumpet, and a third of the sun was struck, a third of the moon, and a third of the stars, so that a third of them turned dark. A third of the day was without light, and also a third of the night. Revelation 8:12
This prophecy is really vague but I believe that it has to do with how busy the world has become and little time we have.
The next trumpets are the three woes the will affect us
13As I watched, I heard an eagle that was flying in midair call out in a loud voice: "Woe! Woe! Woe to the inhabitants of the earth, because of the trumpet blasts about to be sounded by the other three angels!” Revelation 8:13
The US government warned the world about Hussein before the first Gulf war.
Fifth Trumpet
1Then the fifth angel blew his trumpet, and I saw a star that had fallen to earth from the sky, and he was given the key to the shaft of the bottomless pit. 2When he opened it, smoke poured out as though from a huge furnace, and the sunlight and air were darkened by the smoke. 11Their king is the angel from the bottomless pit; his name in Hebrew is Abaddon, and in Greek, Apollyon--the Destroyer. Revelation 9 :1-2,11
Saddam’s name means destroyer
"When Saddam Hussein's mother encountered difficulties in her pregnancy and doctors recommended an abortion, she traveled to Baghdad for medical care and stayed with friends in the Jewish community. Eventually, a healthy boy was delivered, whom she named Saddam, or "destroyer"," for the pain the pregnancy had caused." Jerusalem Post, December 13, 1997
In 1991 when Saddam Hussein realized that he had no choice but to withdraw from Kuwait, he gave the devastating order to set the lucrative oil fields of Kuwait ablaze. The result was unprecedented in the history of the world. Over half of the oil wells of this oil-rich nation, almost 700 in all, were set afire. By the end of the war, 6 million barrels of oil were going up in smoke each day.
During the Kuwait crisis, the sun was blotted out for three months
The skies of Kuwait were so blackened by the smoke that in some areas it was as dark as midnight at 12 noon. It was eight months before the last fire was finally extinguished. One American oil-field engineer, viewing the inferno, said, "You half expect to see little guys with pitchforks and tails coming out of the ground." (People Weekly, December 30, 1991)
Sixth Trumpet
13The sixth angel sounded his trumpet, and I heard a voice coming from the horns of the golden altar that is before God. 14It said to the sixth angel who had the trumpet, "Release the four angels who are bound at the great river Euphrates." 15And the four angels who had been kept ready for this very hour and day and month and year were released to kill a third of mankind. 16The number of the mounted troops was two hundred million. I heard their number. 17The horses and riders I saw in my vision looked like this: Their breastplates were fiery red, dark blue, and yellow as sulfur. The heads of the horses resembled the heads of lions, and out of their mouths came fire, smoke and sulfur. 18A third of mankind was killed by the three plagues of fire, smoke and sulfur that came out of their mouths. 19The power of the horses was in their mouths and in their tails; for their tails were like snakes, having heads with which they inflict injury.
This has to do with the third world war. I believe that it is a nuclear war and has to do with China who boast an army of 200 men, but I do not believe that we are in that right know because of other prophecies that have not been filled yet.
[B]Has to happen before the sixth trumpet
15"The time will come when you will see what Daniel the prophet spoke about: the sacrilegious object that causes desecration[a] standing in the Holy Place"--reader, pay attention! 16"Then those in Judea must flee to the hills. 17A person outside the house must not go inside to pack. 18A person in the field must not return even to get a coat. 19How terrible it will be for pregnant women and for mothers nursing their babies in those days. 20And pray that your flight will not be in winter or on the Sabbath. 21For that will be a time of greater horror than anything the world has ever seen or will ever see again. Matthew 24: 15-21
27 He will confirm a covenant with many for one 'seven.' In the middle of the ‘seven’ he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on a wing of the temple he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him. Daniel 9:27
A leader (the Anti-Christ) will stand in the rebuilt temple in Jerusalem and will confirm a peace agreement for the Middle East. Israel will give up the West Bank (Judea) and any Jews left there will suffer greatly.
After 3 ½ years the Anti-Christ will come back to the temple and state that he is God. This is the abomination of desolation.
Note the one ‘seven’ refers to one year times seven or seven years.
[B]The Third Temple
1I was given a reed like a measuring rod and was told, Go and measure the temple of God and the altar, and count the worshipers there. 2But exclude the outer court; do not measure it, because it has been given to the Gentiles. They will trample on the holy city for 42 months. 3And I will give power to my two witnesses, and they will prophesy for 1,260 days, clothed in sackcloth. Revelation 11:1-3
Israel will rebuild the temple and will share it (only the outer court) with non-Jews. They will resume animal sacrifices for 3 ½ years. The Red Heifer needed for these sacrifices (described in Numbers 19:2) have just reached the proper age.
2 This is a requirement of the law that the LORD has commanded: Tell the Israelites to bring you a red heifer without defect or blemish and that has never been under a yoke. Numbers 19:2
sparks
12-20-2006, 04:27 AM
Ok, this is alot to take in all at once. However it strikes me that one can read into prophecy whatever they want to read in to it. Why couldn't these wars be wars that were fought long, long ago? Who can say with any accuracy what the symbols represent and what time frame they represent?
While I find your interpretation interesting to ponder I also realize it's but another interpretation of someone wanting to predict the end times. Jesus told us that no one will no the time...no one. Period.
So, throughout the generations the guessing games are still being played by evangelists and lay people alike. Why?
You are right no one will know the day or the hour of his coming, but we were also told that we can know the season. That is the reason there are certain events described of in the Bible.
1 Thessalonians 5
1 Now, brothers and sisters, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, 2 for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. 3 While people are saying, "Peace and safety," destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape.
4 But you, brothers and sisters, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief. 5 You are all children of the light and children of the day. We do not belong to the night or to the darkness.
sparks
12-20-2006, 04:41 AM
You are right no one will know the day or the hour of his coming, but we were also told that we can know the season. That is the reason there are certain events described of in the Bible.
1 Thessalonians 5
1 Now, brothers and sisters, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, 2 for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. 3 While people are saying, "Peace and safety," destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape.
4 But you, brothers and sisters, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief. 5 You are all children of the light and children of the day. We do not belong to the night or to the darkness.
The quote in Matthew about "pray that your flight be not in winter" suggests that the season can't be known either.
People like to be able to put things in nice neat little boxes, but prophecy can't be placed neatly within a box in my opinion. It is far to speculatory.
The quote in Matthew about "pray that your flight be not in winter" suggests that the season can't be known either.
He is specifically talking about when the Abonitation of desolation comes. When I refer to season I am not talking about Winter, summer, spring, or fall. I am talking about being in the endtimes
The whole passage in Matthew is this
Matthew 24:15-25
15"So when you see standing in the holy place 'the abomination that causes desolation,'[a (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%2024:15-25;&version=31;#fen-NIV-23970a)] spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand— 16then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. 17Let no one on the roof of his house go down to take anything out of the house. 18Let no one in the field go back to get his cloak. 19How dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! 20Pray that your flight will not take place in winter or on the Sabbath. 21For then there will be great distress, unequaled from the beginning of the world until now—and never to be equaled again. 22If those days had not been cut short, no one would survive, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened. 23At that time if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or, 'There he is!' do not believe it. 24For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect—if that were possible. 25See, I have told you ahead of time.
People like to be able to put things in nice neat little boxes, but prophecy can't be placed neatly within a box in my opinion. It is far to speculatory.
I am not putting it in a box. Remember the Jews missed his first coming because the refused to trust prophecy also. If they would have opened their eyes they would have known who Jesus was. Events are described in the Bible so that we can know the season and in doing so be prepared for what will happen.
sparks
12-20-2006, 04:58 AM
I am not putting it in a box. Remember the Jews missed his first coming because the refused to trust prophecy also. If they would have opened their eyes they would have known who Jesus was. Events are described in the Bible so that we can know the season and in doing so be prepared for what will happen.
16then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. 17Let no one on the roof of his house go down to take anything out of the house. 18Let no one in the field go back to get his cloak.
And how does one prepare for such a thing when Jesus Himself says not to go back to your house for anything and to flee into the mountains? How does one prepare for catastrophe when they don't have a place to prepare? And what good would it do you if you did have preparations? One would be fighting everyone else to keep his preparations in tact, which would lead to more death and destruction, hoarding and greed. Not very Christian like behaviour.
He was specifically talking to those Jews living Judea (West Bank) at the time of the Abonitation of Desolation. You are taking verses out of context.
15"So when you see standing in the holy place 'the abomination that causes desolation,'[a (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%2024:15-25;&version=31;#fen-NIV-23970a)] spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand— 16then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. 17Let no one on the roof of his house go down to take anything out of the house. 18Let no one in the field go back to get his cloak
We can prepare because the Bible talks about things that will happen at the Endtime, ie: persecution, numbering (Number of the Beast), war, famine, and etc.
sparks
12-20-2006, 05:09 AM
He was specifically talking to those Jews living Judea (West Bank) at the time of the Abonitation of Desolation. You are taking verses out of context.
15"So when you see standing in the holy place 'the abomination that causes desolation,'[a (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%2024:15-25;&version=31;#fen-NIV-23970a)] spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand— 16then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. 17Let no one on the roof of his house go down to take anything out of the house. 18Let no one in the field go back to get his cloak
We can prepare because the Bible talks about things that will happen at the Endtime, ie: persecution, numbering (Number of the Beast), war, famine, and etc.
Is it your premise that America won't be touched through all this upheaval? That Christians living in the United States won't suffer the end times?
What do you believe about the rapture? Or do you believe in the rapture at all?
Ok Yes American will be touched and but this passage excusively talks about the people in Judea.
There are other passage that say what happes to others.
After the AoD (Aboniation if Desolation) there will be persecution such as the would has never seen.
Also there will be a war BEFORE Armageddon that will kill 1/3 mankind. (if there are 6 billion people on the earth then 2 billion will perish due to this war)
Also People will be numbered and if you don;t have or get this number then you will not be able to buy or sell. Note Christians ar forbid by God to take this number, doing so will damn you for eternity. Also I believe that RFID chips will be the way we are numbered
As to the Rapture, I am still undecided. I know it will happen I just am not sure ot when. Honestly I believe it will be a Post-Trib rapture but hope it is a Pre-Trib
Here is one reason I believe it is Post-Trib
Matthew 24:29-31 (KJV)
Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: [30] And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. [31] And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
sparks
12-20-2006, 05:31 AM
Ok Yes American will be touched and but this passage excusively talks about the people in Judea.
There are other passage that say what happes to others.
I'd be interested in hearing your theory about what will happen in the United States during the end times. I may not agree with your theory but I would find it interesting none the less.
Ok, you've had fair warning! :lmao
I find the interpretation of prophecy rather haphazard at best. A hit or miss proposition. There have been many books written over the years actually predicting dates due to the world politics at the time...none of them so far have predicted accurately. Why would your theories be any different than all the other failed predictions?
Ok first let me say that these aren't my theories. I believe these theories but I did not come up with them. (Though after reading them I did do a poot-load of studing and research before I just believed them)
The person that put these theories out there is Dr. Irving Baxter Jr.
I guess the link didn't post I will get it
A for the US Prophetically speaking there isn't much said about it. Now that being said at the rate we are going we will be part of the One World Government and therfore be against Israel at Armageddon.
Ther are a few passages in Revelation that I believe are about the US
Revelation 12:14
14The woman was given the two wings of a great eagle, so that she might fly to the place prepared for her in the desert, where she would be taken care of for a time, times and half a time, out of the serpent's reach.
This is before the AoD and Third Temple being built. (Like now)
The Eagle (America) is protecting the woman (Israel). Isn't tha texactly what we are doing now?
Revelation 8:13
13As I watched, I heard an eagle that was flying in midair call out in a loud voice: "Woe! Woe! Woe to the inhabitants of the earth, because of the trumpet blasts about to be sounded by the other three angels!"
Revelation 9
1The fifth angel sounded his trumpet, and I saw a star that had fallen from the sky to the earth. The star was given the key to the shaft of the Abyss. 2When he opened the Abyss, smoke rose from it like the smoke from a gigantic furnace. The sun and sky were darkened by the smoke from the Abyss. 3And out of the smoke locusts came down upon the earth and were given power like that of scorpions of the earth. 4They were told not to harm the grass of the earth or any plant or tree, but only those people who did not have the seal of God on their foreheads. 5They were not given power to kill them, but only to torture them for five months. And the agony they suffered was like that of the sting of a scorpion when it strikes a man. 6During those days men will seek death, but will not find it; they will long to die, but death will elude them
I guessing that you read the OP and know what I believe that the 5th and 6th trumpets are.
Weren't we (America) the ones that warned the world about Saddam and aren't we also the ones warning about China right now?
I found the link
http://ryanj1678.tripod.com/christianity4today/id35.htm
and
http://www.endtime.com/
Here is something else that is interesting
The CIA has reported in their World Fact Book that China could field 200 million men
https://www.cia.gov/cia/publications...k/geos/ch.html (https://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/ch.html)
Just scroll down to military.
12Then the sixth angel poured out his bowl on the great Euphrates River, and it dried up so that the kings from the east could march their armies westward without hindrance. 13And I saw three evil spirits that looked like frogs leap from the mouth of the dragon, the beast, and the false prophet. 14These miracle-working demons caused all the rulers of the world to gather for battle against the Lord on that great judgment day of God Almighty. Revelation 16:12-14
http://www.adiyamanli.org/ataturk_dam.htm (http://www.adiyamanli.org/ataturk_dam.htm)
Makes you wonder doesn't it?
sparks
12-20-2006, 06:28 AM
Ok first let me say that these aren't my theories. I believe these theories but I did not come up with them. (Though after reading them I did do a poot-load of studing and research before I just believed them)
The person that put these theories out there is Dr. Irving Baxter Jr.
I guess the link didn't post I will get it
A for the US Prophetically speaking there isn't much said about it. Now that being said at the rate we are going we will be part of the One World Government and therfore be against Israel at Armageddon.
Ther are a few passages in Revelation that I believe are about the US
This is before the AoD and Third Temple being built. (Like now)
The Eagle (America) is protecting the woman (Israel). Isn't tha texactly what we are doing now?
I guessing that you read the OP and know what I believe that the 5th and 6th trumpets are.
Weren't we (America) the ones that warned the world about Saddam and aren't we also the ones warning about China right now?
We've been an ally to Israel for a long time now...this isn't a recent development.
Also, Dr. Irving Baxter's theories are still just theories. They may be his best guess, but a guess none the less.
I remember back during the cold war, folks were saying that the end of the world was at hand and it would be the USSR nuking us and us nuking them back...it never happened. Folks back then were taking world politics and infusing them as interpretations of prophecy...and it's still happening only the world politics are different today.
Bottom line, I have a hard time believing anyone's interpretation of prophecy although I do find it a fascinating subject and I do like to ponder the speculation...but ultimately I consider it just that...speculation.
Here is the main thing. Just so long as Jesus is your Lord and Savior then that is all that matters really.
I just love studying prophecy
Here is the main thing. Just so long as Jesus is your Lord and Savior then that is all that matters really.
I just love studying prophecy
Agreed, as long as you're a Believer, you have nothing to worry about when the time comes.
I've been reading the ''Left Behind'' series which is all about the author's take on the end times, Very fascinating and thought provoking.
Read them, very good books. Don't agree with every thing said but good none the less.
FunDeeMental
12-20-2006, 09:16 AM
If you really want to be challanged in some of your theology, you should read some books by Harold Eberle :yep
I'll check him out, thanks
April15
12-20-2006, 04:16 PM
The end of the earths ability to sustain carbon based life will be at the suns nova.
Always the optimist aren't we?
April15
12-21-2006, 09:27 AM
Just pointing out facts.
UMMM no a fact is something that you can prove. Besides this thread never said anything about the earth not being able to support life.
The earth will not end it abideth forever and it is on this very earth that the Bible teaches we will spend eternity. Currently, those who are present with the Lord in heaven are in spirit except for Jesus, Enoch, Elijah and possibly Moses??? However there is some doubt about Moses because the Bible says he died and God hid his body. (This is where the quandry comes in, it does not say he buried him)
The Bible interprets itself and Prophecy is not for any one man or group of men but we all equally can understand it if we pray and put forth the effort. The difficult thing is to admit, on many things, we don't know.
The U.S. does not figure into the final scenario as a major power. It is my conclusion that only one thing prevents us from being destroyed by God right now and that is the few real Christians that live here. The Rapture should make us fair game! (When the living Christans are suddenly taken out and given a new body after those that have died have theirs and then for precisely seven years we will be absent from the earth until we caome back as the Lion of Judahs fighting force and kill those in opposition to the Lord of Lords. This will be the beginning of the seventh day. It will not be until a thousand years later that sin will be done away with on earth and in the universe.
George Bush's, 'Roadmap To Peace', is one reason we are to be cursed as a nation. God strictly forbid any people from tampering with the land he gave Israel. He said long ago he would bless those that blessed Israel and curse those that cursed Israel. Condeliza Rice, has called Israel 'Occupiers' as she sucked up to the Dune Coons. This sets us up for destruction, the destruction called Armageddon and all nations will be judged for how it treated God's people. He has had a long time to hold back his rage and we are but a couple of years at most away from that event.
We may not know the day or the hour, but we are commanded to watch and know the year!!! We are with certainty in the very last moments of time...at the very threshold of a seven year period of hell on earth where demonic forces are set loose on mankind and every cruel thing happening at random.
One prophecy we have seen fulfilled right here is those saying: 'Show me the sign of his coming!' 'All things are the same since our fathers have gone to sleep'
April15
12-31-2006, 11:14 AM
You guys are just too wacked out for rational discussion.
You guys are just too wacked out for rational discussion.
You just are not up to seeing all of your bullshit conclusions blown out of the water by the truth!
TrueBlue
01-01-2007, 09:14 AM
Always the optimist aren't we?
Hey, AYFR, your prophecies are not optimistic, either.
April15
01-01-2007, 01:32 PM
UMMM no a fact is something that you can prove. Besides this thread never said anything about the earth not being able to support life.I would beg to differ! You are going on the assumption of there being a supreme creator, I don't. So when it is said the armegedon is coming to me that is the nova of the sun.
April15
01-01-2007, 01:34 PM
You just are not up to seeing all of your bullshit conclusions blown out of the water by the truth!The ideas I have are not being blown anywhere. The truth is something, in this case, that evades your perceptional abilities.
BillyJack
01-01-2007, 02:12 PM
Isn't the Bible in the Fiction Section of the bookstore?
TrueBlue
01-01-2007, 02:15 PM
It's in the religious section, next to the Koran and the Vedas. :wave
BillyJack
01-01-2007, 02:18 PM
It's in the religious section, next to the Koran and the Vedas. :wave
That's what I said. The Fiction Section. :lmao
Hey, AYFR, your prophecies are not optimistic, either.
No they aren't, but then again I didn't write them so they aren't my prophecies. They are the prophecies that are in the Bible.
I would beg to differ! You are going on the assumption of there being a supreme creator, I don't. So when it is said the armegedon is coming to me that is the nova of the sun.
touche
Isn't the Bible in the Fiction Section of the bookstore?
Ummm no it is in the religious section which is seperate from fiction. Can you prove anything in the Bible to be fiction?
TrueBlue
01-02-2007, 08:18 AM
Much of the Bible is parable and allegory, and that is not nonfiction.
We've been an ally to Israel for a long time now...this isn't a recent development.
Also, Dr. Irving Baxter's theories are still just theories. They may be his best guess, but a guess none the less.
I remember back during the cold war, folks were saying that the end of the world was at hand and it would be the USSR nuking us and us nuking them back...it never happened. Folks back then were taking world politics and infusing them as interpretations of prophecy...and it's still happening only the world politics are different today.
Bottom line, I have a hard time believing anyone's interpretation of prophecy although I do find it a fascinating subject and I do like to ponder the speculation...but ultimately I consider it just that...speculation.
:arrr
bottom line is...you don't believe in the Bible period.
nothing anyone tells you will ever make sense unless you receive the Holy Spirit and the Spirit reveal it to you !!
Isn't the Bible in the Fiction Section of the bookstore?
no
Kurtz
01-02-2007, 02:33 PM
:arrr
bottom line is...you don't believe in the Bible period.
nothing anyone tells you will ever make sense unless you receive the Holy Spirit and the Spirit reveal it to you !!
That depends on who the someone is and what they are sayin', don't you think?
April15
01-02-2007, 02:59 PM
Ummm no it is in the religious section which is seperate from fiction. Can you prove anything in the Bible to be fiction?Seas do not part, the hydrogen needed to create enough water to cover the earth does not exist, bushes do not talk except to people on acid, and only with modern medicine do people rise from the dead.
Kurtz
01-02-2007, 03:02 PM
Seas do not part, the hydrogen needed to create enough water to cover the earth does not exist, bushes do not talk except to people on acid, and only with modern medicine do people rise from the dead.
Hey, that sea partin' story was eventually explained by a drought during that time period, course, it was a scientific examination so it probably isn't true. :wink
That depends on who the someone is and what they are sayin', don't you think?
well Maybe...if it were Jesus, standing there in the flesh she might
BillyJack
01-02-2007, 06:45 PM
Ummm no it is in the religious section which is seperate from fiction. Can you prove anything in the Bible to be fiction?
The burden of proof is not on me.
April15
01-02-2007, 07:37 PM
That depends on who the someone is and what they are sayin', don't you think?I knew of a preacher who used to get the women folk all full of the holy spirit. But that was back in the thirties. John Steinbeck even wrote a book that included the reverend JC.
April15
01-02-2007, 07:38 PM
well Maybe...if it were Jesus, standing there in the flesh she mightI know a lot of mexicans named jesus. Which one you talking about?
BillyJack
01-02-2007, 07:54 PM
I know a lot of mexicans named jesus. Which one you talking about?
You mean Heyzeus don't you April? :lol
Phoenix
01-02-2007, 08:07 PM
Interesting, AYFR! I am enjoying *most* of the discussion! I have always kind of avoided the book of Revelations and the end times stuff.
The burden of proof is not on me.
no the Bible says it is true but you say it is fiction, the burden is on you.
What's wrong can't do it?
BillyJack
01-02-2007, 09:42 PM
no the Bible says it is true but you say it is fiction, the burden is on you.
What's wrong can't do it?
No the burden is not on me. "Bible Says" don't get it. When ever you get into a religious argument with a Christian, the first words out of their mouths are: "But the Bible says".
The Bible is just a book. It wasn't written by God (prove it was) but by men.
Sorry. My last statement is factual.
But for those that want to believe its teachings, what ever makes you happy and a better human being is a good thing.
TrueBlue
01-02-2007, 09:53 PM
Where does the Bible say it is true? Is there a specific passage to which you are referring?
Kurtz
01-02-2007, 09:55 PM
:popcorn
Oooh, front row
Semantics
01-02-2007, 09:58 PM
:popcorn
Oooh, front row
:popcorn Stop hogging it. :lol
BillyJack
01-02-2007, 10:05 PM
A feel a Spanish Inquisition coming this way.
http://aycu24.webshots.com/image/8783/2004089508696244854_rs.jpg
April15
01-02-2007, 10:22 PM
A feel a Spanish Inquisition coming this way.
http://aycu24.webshots.com/image/8783/2004089508696244854_rs.jpg
Who wants to be the witch?
Kurtz
01-02-2007, 10:30 PM
Who wants to be the witch?
Oh hell, I'll do it! :woot
April15
01-02-2007, 10:34 PM
Oh hell, I'll do it! :wootOh goody a BarB que. Someone get a stake.
Kurtz
01-02-2007, 10:36 PM
Oh goody a BarB que. Someone get a stake.
Make mine a rib eye! :lmao
April15
01-02-2007, 10:44 PM
Make mine a rib eye! :lmaoThat would be your rib. Stake is wooden pole, steak is food. We burn witches in the inquisition!
Kurtz
01-02-2007, 10:48 PM
That would be your rib. Stake is wooden pole, steak is food. We burn witches in the inquisition!
Hey, let's be historical here, use the waterboard, get the instructions from Cheney!:lmao
sparks
01-02-2007, 10:52 PM
:arrr
bottom line is...you don't believe in the Bible period.
nothing anyone tells you will ever make sense unless you receive the Holy Spirit and the Spirit reveal it to you !!
I just love it when folks tell me what I think! And when they make assumptions it's even funnier! :lmao
Where does the Bible say it is true? Is there a specific passage to which you are referring?
John 17:17
17Sanctify[a (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John+17:17#fen-NIV-26766a)] them by the truth; your word is truth.
2 Timothy 3:16
16All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness
No the burden is not on me. "Bible Says" don't get it. When ever you get into a religious argument with a Christian, the first words out of their mouths are: "But the Bible says".
The Bible is just a book. It wasn't written by God (prove it was) but by men.
Sorry. My last statement is factual.
But for those that want to believe its teachings, what ever makes you happy and a better human being is a good thing.
Fine proof
Another striking evidence of divine inspiration is found in the fact that many of the principles of modern science were recorded as facts of nature in the Bible long before scientist confirmed them experimentally. A sampling of these would include:
Roundness of the earth (Isaiah 40:22 (http://www.christiananswers.net/bible/isa40.html#22))
Almost infinite extent of the sidereal universe (Isaiah 55:9 (http://www.christiananswers.net/bible/isa55.html#9))
Law of conservation of mass and energy (II Peter 3:7 (http://www.christiananswers.net/bible/2pet3.html#7))
Hydrologic cycle (Ecclesiastes 1:7 (http://www.christiananswers.net/bible/eccl1.html#7))
Vast number of stars (Jeremiah 33:22 (http://www.christiananswers.net/bible/jer33.html#22))
Law of increasing entropy (Psalm 102:25-27 (http://www.christiananswers.net/bible/psa102.html#25))
Paramount importance of blood in life processes (Leviticus 17:11 (http://www.christiananswers.net/bible/lev17.html#11))
Atmospheric circulation (Ecclesiastes 1:6 (http://www.christiananswers.net/bible/eccl1.html#6))
Gravitational field (Job 26:7 (http://www.christiananswers.net/bible/job26.html#7))
and many others.These are not stated in the technical jargon of modern science, of course, but in terms of the basic world of man's everyday experience; nevertheless, they are completely in accord with the most modern scientific facts.
It is significant also that no real mistake has ever been demonstrated in the Bible -- in science, in history, or in any other subject. Many have been claimed, of course, but conservative Bible scholars have always been able to work out reasonable solutions to all such problems.
http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-t003.html
[/URL]
(http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-t003.html)[URL]http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/science.shtml
(http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/science.shtml)http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/b_proof.shtml
(http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/science.shtml)http://www.christiananswers.net/archaeology/home.html
(http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/science.shtml)
Need more
Oh and yes the Bible was written by man but inspired by God
Hey, let's be historical here, use the waterboard, get the instructions from Cheney!:lmao
Cheney doesn't have the balls to do it himself. He has to get others to do his dirty work while he hides behind the President.
BillyJack
01-02-2007, 11:24 PM
Need more
Oh and yes the Bible was written by man but inspired by God
No. That was more than enough to reinforce what I already know to be true.
So from your last sentence you agree that the Bible is the words of men and not God?
Kurtz
01-02-2007, 11:28 PM
No. That was more than enough to reinforce what I already know to be true.
So from your last sentence you agree that the Bible is the words of men and not God?
One thing's for damn sure: Men interpret the Bible!
sparks
01-02-2007, 11:30 PM
One thing's for damn sure: Men interpret the Bible!
And usually in any way that suits them. :wink
Kurtz
01-02-2007, 11:34 PM
And usually in any way that suits them. :wink
Susan B. Anthony :wink
BillyJack
01-02-2007, 11:36 PM
One thing's for damn sure: Men interpret the Bible!
:yep
I can't believe some people make a living interpreting it. Very good livings.
No. That was more than enough to reinforce what I already know to be true.
You make no sense. I show you proof that the Bible is truthful and accurate and you say you it reinforces your position. LOL
So from your last sentence you agree that the Bible is the words of men and not God?
No the Bible is the word of God written by man. Believe it or not God does speak to his people.
TrueBlue
01-03-2007, 06:49 AM
John 17:17
17Sanctify[a (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John+17:17#fen-NIV-26766a)] them by the truth; your word is truth.
2 Timothy 3:16
16All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness
Great verses! But they do not proclaim the literal truth of the Bible. The Bible is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting, and training.
I believe that the Bible also says that the Earth has four corners. It diminishes the value of the Bible to use it as a science book, IMO.
BillyJack
01-03-2007, 06:51 AM
No the Bible is the word of God written by man. Believe it or not God does speak to his people.
I thought he only spoke to Pat Robertson. :lmao
Great verses! But they do not proclaim the literal truth of the Bible. The Bible is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting, and training.
I believe that the Bible also says that the Earth has four corners. It diminishes the value of the Bible to use it as a science book, IMO.
I have already covered the four corners thing
Also I did not say that the Bible was a science book this is a prophecy thread.
Lastly the Bible is God's word right?
Well if it is God's word then according to John 17:17
His word is the truth.
I thought he only spoke to Pat Robertson. :lmao
Unfortunately Pat also thinks he is the only one God talks to.
Bush apparently thinks this as well.
TrueBlue
01-03-2007, 06:48 PM
I have already covered the four corners thing
Also I did not say that the Bible was a science book this is a prophecy thread.
Lastly the Bible is God's word right?
Well if it is God's word then according to John 17:17
His word is the truth.
I'm sorry, I guess I missed the four corners thing. Is it in this thread?
To use the Bible in this way makes it a science book.
And truth means spirtual and wisdom truth, not science fact.
Prophecy has nothing to do with science.
Just because a book says the earth is round doesn't make it a science book, Lots of books do that.
Why are you trying to argue science here?
That is on the other thread.
Prophecy is a religious arguement not a scientific one.
Oh and nowhrere does it say that God's truth is only spiritual and wisdom truth.
TrueBlue
01-03-2007, 06:56 PM
Prophecy has nothing to do with science.
Just because a book says the earth is round doesn't make it a science book, Lots of books do that.
Why are you trying to argue science here?
That is on the other thread.
Prophecy is a religious arguement not a scientific one.
Oh and nowhrere does it say that God's truth is only spiritual and wisdom truth.
Science has been introduced into this thread, too. Read the previous page.
Point is I did not introduce science into this thread and I am talking about Prophecy which has nothing to do with science.
I believe that what the Bible says about the future to be true.
Nothing scientific about that.
April brought in science but then again he doesn't want to discuss prophecy either.
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