US reports ‘phenomenal’ drop in Iraq violence

[Wabash]

By Stephen Fidler in London and Demetri Sevastopulo in Australia

Published: November 20 2007 22:15 | Last updated: November 20 2007 22:15

Violence in Iraq has fallen at a rate that has surprised military commanders and even one of the architects of the “surge” that boosted US troop numbers in the country this year, according to figures gathered by the US.

The figures show the numbers of suicide attacks, roadside bombings, mortar and other attacks on US forces and on the Iraqi population have more than halved since 30,000 extra troops in June.

The military attributes the decline to the surge, the spread of local ceasefire deals across Iraq, a ceasefire by radical Shia militias and an improvement in the Iraqi security forces.

Jack Keane, the former army general who helped persuade George W. Bush, US president, to increase troop numbers in Iraq, said the decrease in violence was “phenomenal” and had occurred far faster than he had expected.

“When you understand you are dealing with the complexity of a counter-insurgency operation which can take years to resolve, to have this dramatic a success in a short period of time, it’s unprecedented,” he said.

The US military says the number of civilian deaths has also fallen 60 per cent since the surge took effect, with a drop of 75 per cent in Baghdad. According to icasualties.org, the average monthly US death toll dropped from 96 for the first half of 2007 to 66 in the past four months. The average monthly death toll for Iraqi civilians and security forces has dropped from 2,157 to 1,223 in the same period.

Stephen Biddle, former adviser to General David Petraeus, the top US commander in Iraq, said the most important factor was the spread of ceasefire agreements. He said the “key challenge” now was to make sure they could be adequately policed.

“I am very concerned that if we bring too many of the troops home too fast we leave ourselves without the ability to stabilise these otherwise quite unstable local ceasefire deals.”

While the military displays cautious optimism, however, some experts are less convinced. Anthony Cordesman, a defence expert at the Center for Strategic and International Studies, said the statistics did not capture the true picture of violence in Iraq.

“The [numbers] that the coalition counts tend to omit most of the violence in the south, which is Shiite-on-Shiite, and lower-level tensions between Arabs and Kurds. It also doesn’t seem to count Sunni-on-Sunni unless it is al-Qaeda versus anti-al-Qaeda.”
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/ca653412-97b4-11dc-9e08-0000779fd2ac.html?nclick_check=1

[toxic]

But how is the mission going?

[Saguaro]

Wabash, you don't even want to go there .

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/09/24/AR2007092401929.html

http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2007/10/counting_civilian_deaths_in_ir.html

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2007/09/20070920-3.html

I can find more if you need it

[Lone Laugher]

Oh...Great. I have decided to change my mind about this occupation after reading that article. Bush was right all along! The decision to invade Iraq was sound. This makes everything that went wrong all forgotten and forgiven.


Give me a fucking break.

[Saguaro]

BAGHDAD - Two bombs exploded hours apart Friday in a central Baghdad pet market and a police checkpoint in the northern Iraqi city of Mosul, killing 26 people and wounding dozens, officials said.

The attacks were among the deadliest in recent weeks, underscoring warnings by senior U.S. commanders that extremists still pose a threat to Iraq's fragile security despite a downturn in violence since a U.S.-Iraqi security plan began in mid-February.

The blast in the capital's popular weekly al-Ghazl animal bazaar occurred just before 9 a.m., shattering the festive atmosphere as people strolled past the stalls.

At least 13 people were killed and nearly 60 wounded, including four policemen, according to police and hospital officials. Several shops also were damaged.

About 1:30 p.m. in Mosul, a suicide car bomber struck a police checkpoint, killing three policemen and 10 civilians, said police Brig. Gen. Mohammed al-Wakaa.

The al-Ghazl market, where sellers peddle birds, dogs, cats, sheep, goats and exotic animals such as snakes and monkeys, has been targeted in the past. On Jan. 26, 15 people were killed when a bomb hidden in a box of pigeons exploded as shoppers gathered around it.

Friday's blast was particularly significant because it dealt a blow to an increased feeling of confidence among Iraqis about the recent calm in the capital and surrounding areas.

Brig. Gen. Qassim al-Moussawi, the Iraqi military spokesman for Baghdad, said the explosives were hidden in a box carrying pigeons and other small birds.

"The security situation is moving in the right direction toward the better, but there are still pockets that make use of such opportunities as the presence of different kinds of animals and birds to carry out the ugliest crimes," he told Iraqi state television.

The market has regained popularity after the lifting of a four-hour Friday driving ban to protect prayer services from car bombings. The Iraqi government lifted the weekly ban in September, citing the improving security situation.

A local storeowner who would only give his name as Abu Zainab said he had only reopened his business two weeks ago.

"I was reluctant to open it after lifting the curfew because of security concerns," he said of his cleaning supply store that is about 150 yards from the blast site.

"Today, the view of many young men coming with pets, colorful fish in aquariums and dogs was very encouraging and cheerful," he said. "There were also teenagers selling sandwiches and tea in wheeled carts giving the impression that life is back to normal again, but about 9 o'clock, we heard the sound of an explosion."

He described a scene of chaos, with birds flying through smoke as the bodies of young men who had been killed and wounded lay on the ground.

"We helped evacuate some of them, then the Iraqi police and army came and told us to leave because they feared another explosion could take place," he said.

Amir Aziz, a 22-year-old pigeon vendor who was wounded by shrapnel, said he was in the middle of a transaction when the blast occurred.

"Today, the market was very crowded and we were happy about that," he said. "The Iraqi security officials have deceived us by their statements that the situation is 80 percent better. People believed them and began to go out thinking that it would be safe. I think that the situation will become worse again."

In other violence, a parked car bomb targeted a police patrol in Shurqat, 155 miles northwest of Baghdad, killing one officer and wounding 15 others, along with one civilian, authorities said.

The U.S. military also said a mortar attack late Thursday struck the base in Balad, 50 miles north of Baghdad, killing one Iraqi and wounding two. There were no coalition casualties.

The top U.S. commander in northern Iraq, Army Maj. Gen. Mark P. Hertling, warned earlier this month that northern Iraq has become more violent than other regions as al-Qaida and other militants move there to avoid military operations elsewhere.

On Friday, U.S. troops detained seven suspects in three coordinated raids against al-Qaida in Iraq's media network southeast of the northern city of Samarra, the military said.

"Defeating al-Qaida's propaganda networks undermines their fundraising and recruiting," said Maj. Winfield Danielson, a U.S. military spokesman.

U.S. officials say attacks have dropped 55 percent nationwide since June. But American military commanders repeatedly have warned that Iraq is by no means stable, even though the violence is declining.

Al-Moussawi also urged Iraqis to be patient, insisting that U.S. and Iraqi forces were gaining the upper hand but "pockets of terrorists" still exist.

"Thank God that our people are still challenging the circumstances and they have broken the barrier of fear," he said. "The people have to stay alert and continue cooperating with us so as not to give the terrorists any opportunities to carry out such cowardly operations."

In another development, the Iraqi government said 31 South Asian workers detained after a shooting involving foreign security guards face charges of illegally entering the country.

Government spokesman Ali al-Dabbagh told The Associated Press that the 21 Sri Lankans, nine Nepalese and one Indian would appear before a magistrate Sunday.

"We call upon all companies operating in Iraq to register and settle the status of the foreign employees," he said. "The companies should make sure that their workers have official visas from Iraqi authorities."

The workers were picked up Tuesday after police said the security guards protecting their convoy opened fire in Baghdad's Karradah district, wounding a woman. Two Fijian and 10 Iraqi security guards are under investigation for assault.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071123/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq;_ylt=AtsE.a8MhJGbPnULck6Kzlus0NUE

[Wabash]

Violence is down significantly, it's just the beginning of more normal Life in Bagdad!

[Saguaro]

There are more places than Baghdad in Iraq
Did you not read my previous post ?

[Lone Laugher]

Violence is down significantly, it's just the beginning of more normal Life in Bagdad!

:hpoop

[crazierthanever]

:hpoop

I like a direct answer! :paclap

[Trueblue]

There are more places than Baghdad in Iraq
Did you not read my previous post ?

Doubt it. :lol

[Wabash]

There are more places than Baghdad in Iraq
Did you not read my previous post ?

Yep...just read it...What's your point?

[Saguaro]

We have been lied to yet again ,that is my point

[Wabash]

We have been lied to yet again ,that is my point

NO WE Haven't!!! That's MY point!

"The security situation is moving in the right direction toward the better, but there are still pockets that make use of such opportunities as the presence of different kinds of animals and birds to carry out the ugliest crimes," he told Iraqi state television.


The report that I posted didn't say they were Trouble Free, but the turn around has been very good. It ain't perfect...hell it's far from perfect here...there are violent people all over OUR country!
Violence doesn't have to be bombs....
There is a long way to go over there...but lied to? that is a real stretch and a biased approach!

[Saguaro]

If it comes from this administration or the pentagon, it's a lie

[Trueblue]

The Washington Post made it clear that the idea that the violence is down is questionable to say the least.

Ever since our troops went into Iraq, some neocon has been complaining because we don't hear enough about the good things in Iraq.

[Saguaro]

CNN) -- A suicide bomber targeting NATO soldiers who were working on a construction project in Kabul exploded Saturday morning, killing six civilians -- mostly children -- and an Italian soldier, according to Italy's Defense Ministry and the Afghan Interior Ministry.

The blast also wounded wounding nine civilians and three Italian soldiers assigned to NATO's International Security Assistance Force (ISAF), the ministries said.

Afghan Interior Ministry spokesman Zemari Bashary said the bomber apparently had an explosives vest hidden under his clothing.

The Italian ministry statement said the soldiers were in the area to inaugurate a bridge built under a NATO project.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/11/24/saturday/index.html

[Wabash]

If it comes from this administration or the pentagon, it's a lie

And you believed all the lies from the Clinton Adm. w/o question huh? Total bias Sag...total!

The Washington Post made it clear that the idea that the violence is down is questionable to say the least.

Ever since our troops went into Iraq, some neocon has been complaining because we don't hear enough about the good things in Iraq.

Ya, and many others sources from the NYT to most TV networks say otherwise!

It is NOT over, they have a ways to go...but we ARE winning and the majority of the Violence is diminished!
We will still have pockets of resistence, probalby for many months yet.
I swear give you libs a little info and you go nuts if it's not what you want to hear!
If W ever turned out to be a hero, would you all commit suicide?

[Lone Laugher]

WHAT ARE WE WINNING????? PLEASE EXPLAIN.

[Wabash]

WHAT ARE WE WINNING????? PLEASE EXPLAIN.

The battle against the Islamofacist insurgency and vicariously the Life Long war against Islam. It's been going on for centuries and will continue for our life times, until they give up or are annihilated or the same happens to us. The Demos, like Harry Reid, offer the Wrong example!
Co-existence is futile, given our oppossite idealology. I'm sure many on both sides would like to live in peace, as would I......but I really don't see it happening.
This is merely one battle with many in the future...

[Lone Laugher]

You have absolutely no interest in learning. You have been spooked into declaring war against a religion. You have no ability to empathise with followers of Islam....the OVERWHELMING majority of whom are in no way "radical". You do not understand that the small number of Muslim extremeists see YOU and your bullshit religion as being the radical one. YOU ARE AN EXTREMIST!!!

Difference....you are ALL TALK and allow our kids to do your bidding.

[Saguaro]

The battle against the Islamofacist insurgency and vicariously the Life Long war against Islam. It's been going on for centuries and will continue for our life times, until they give up or are annihilated or the same happens to us. The Demos, like Harry Reid, offer the Wrong example!
Co-existence is futile, given our oppossite idealology. I'm sure many on both sides would like to live in peace, as would I......but I really don't see it happening.
This is merely one battle with many in the future...

What ???? you believe the the radicals propaganda ?

[Trueblue]

And you believed all the lies from the Clinton Adm. w/o question huh? Total bias Sag...total!



Ya, and many others sources from the NYT to most TV networks say otherwise!

It is NOT over, they have a ways to go...but we ARE winning and the majority of the Violence is diminished!
We will still have pockets of resistence, probalby for many months yet.
I swear give you libs a little info and you go nuts if it's not what you want to hear!
If W ever turned out to be a hero, would you all commit suicide?

If Hillary turns out to be a hero, will you? :roll

You are cherry picking your facts, Wabash, on the violence in Iraq.

You have absolutely no interest in learning. You have been spooked into declaring war against a religion. You have no ability to empathise with followers of Islam....the OVERWHELMING majority of whom are in no way "radical". You do not understand that the small number of Muslim extremeists see YOU and your bullshit religion as being the radical one. YOU ARE AN EXTREMIST!!!

Difference....you are ALL TALK and allow our kids to do your bidding.

YES.

[quiet man]

if you look hard enough you can find the silver lining in every cloud!

[Ringo]

There are more places than Baghdad in Iraq
Did you not read my previous post ?

Are you cheering for the Terrorists or praying for anything Bush-American to fail?? These young Men & Women have given their all for the Freedom of the Iraqi's, and DESPITE the Traitor Media and the TRAITORS on the Left at home, they have achieved a lot!!

[Ringo]

If it comes from this administration or the pentagon, it's a lie


As opposed to when Clinton & Spanky were in Office?? That was one BIG LIE from 93-2000, which led to 9/11, thanks to ineptness of Cowardly Traitors like CLINTON-GORE-BERGER ETC...
Bush possesses none of the GOOD LIberal qualities of Clinton-Gore!

Habitual Liars
Traitors
Treasoners
Clinton was a Sex Criminal and possibly child moles...
Clinton was a murderer, Waco, Ron Brown and others
Gore was an idiot, a mentally disturbed person who thought he INVENTED everything, and possessed the mentality of an 11 yr old!!

Be proud Sag, hell the Commies need love too!!:hulk

[Saguaro]

Everyone in the Bush administration are habitual liars .

[Saguaro]

BAGHDAD (Reuters) - Al Qaeda militants killed at least eight members of a neighborhood police patrol in southern Baghdad on Thursday after shooting two Iraqi soldiers and stealing their vehicle, police said.

The al Qaeda fighters drove up to the police patrol in the stolen Iraqi army vehicle before opening fire in an attack in the Hawr Rajab area of southern Baghdad's Doura district, a predominantly Sunni Arab area and al Qaeda stronghold.

An Interior Ministry official confirmed that eight "Awakening Council" members had been killed. He said three Iraqi soldiers were also killed and another three were wounded.

Mainly Sunni Arab tribal sheikhs have been organizing their young men into local police units, known as concerned local citizens, to drive out Sunni Islamist al Qaeda, which have been partly credited for falling levels of violence in Iraq.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20071125/ts_nm/iraq_qaeda_dc;_ylt=Ao8rf7CSZZxq.6Qinny3.Mys0NUE